180 Fakie 5-0, Photo: Raf Wojnowski
How has corona affected the mag? When is the next issue coming out?
Our next issue comes out early May, we’re finishing it up right now. We’ve been having to put it together completely remotely, which is a bit of a mission when it comes to the design aspect of it, but it hasn’t been too bad.
The main thing we’ve had to think about is distribution. We print 20,000 mags, so figuring out how we’re going to get all of them into people’s hands with most of Europe’s physical skate shops being closed has been the main concern. I think we’ve figured it out though: we’ve set up a subscription service via Parade, then they’ll be available from all of the shops that have an online presence (and we’ll be really pushing for people to support these guys when the new issue drops). Finally Keen, our distributor, will be holding some for all the smaller shops who don’t do online, so that when they reopen there’s an extra incentive for kids to walk through the door.
As for the site, are you seeing an increase in traffic with so many people at home globally? Are you seeing a slow down of skate content coming out?
Yeah, there’s definitely been an increase in traffic, and no, there’s not really been any signs of skate content slowing down yet. We’re still getting sent more videos than ever with everyone stuck indoors editing. I reckon it’ll take a good few more months of lock down before that happens.
Outside of corona, let’s talk about the magazine in general. Where is it currently available?
The main bulk of them go to skate shops all over Europe. Then we’ve got some going to key stores in the US via Theories of Atlantis and Keen Distribution, and some going to a few other places like South Korea, but in much smaller quantities.
What made you, Will and Sam want to start the mag back in 2015?
Before starting Free, we were working for a big corporate publisher doing Kingpin, which I sometimes really enjoyed, but also involved a lot of quite painful compromises. When the people paying you don’t skate they inevitably have slightly different goals. Anyway there came a day when they called us all into a meeting to tell us they were cutting the print mag: that Kingpin was going ‘fully digital’, and I guess that was a compromise we weren’t willing to make. I actually remember being in there trying to tell them to reconsider, explaining that skateboarding was a culture that needed print magazines and that they were shooting themselves in the foot. But they weren’t having it. Thank fuck for that haha. When we walked out of that room we went straight to the pub and basically decided there that we were all going to quit and do our own mag. Best decision of my life!
Switch backside Smith, Photo: Henry Kingsford
Were there challenges with getting up and running?
I mean yeah definitely, but considering none of us had any experience in actually setting up a business I’d say it went relatively smoothly. I never could have done it without Sam and Will though, they were definitely more on it than me when it came to that stuff and they also had good people to turn to for advice.
I think we were also lucky in the sense that a lot of people working in skateboard industry really trusted us. And that a proper European mag was something everyone realized they really needed. Mags are such a vital part of skateboarding’s little ecosystem. Like brands know that they need us to advertise the products they sell to skateboarders, and it’s in everyone’s interest for them to do so in order for guys like Lucas Puig or Tom Knox to keep getting paid to film parts and shoot photos. And all these photos and videos need to live somewhere and to be filtered. You could say ‘well, brands could just host all that stuff themselves’, but everyone knows that if a brand is the only voice talking about something they’ve made, then it’s probably wack. You can’t write your own reviews. Also photographers, filmers and professional skateboarders all need proper mags (print + online) to keep getting paid to contribute to our culture. And then you’ve got skate shops. Possibly the most important of all these interdependent entities. If we want them to keep doing cool shit for our scenes and keep everything else moving, then we need to protect and support them at all costs. That’s why our model works so well I think: it’s in everyone’s interest to give kids another excuse to walk through their doors, and a free magazine with a Gustav Tonnessen interview is just that.
Also, we launched Free around a time when a lot of print mags were dying, so on top of everything I mentioned above, I think there was a real desire to protect print, and by extension, skateboard photography. To a lot of us, it felt like something sacred was under threat.
Anyway, because of all this, it meant that almost every brand that could afford to do it, placed ads in the first issue without even having seen any of it, which thinking back on it is kind of mad. Loads of people gave us their videos exclusively, so we could build up our audience (even though we were tiny at the time) and literally hundreds of skaters/filmers/photographers/skate shops reposted that first image of the rising red dot we put on our Instagram to help it get traction. We really owe a lot to all these people.
What are your goals with the mag? Have they shifted overtime?
I guess the goal has always been to get the European skating we find interesting and the stories we want to tell out there to as many people as possible. The tricky thing is that sometimes the two aren’t necessarily compatible. Like not everyone can be a Mike Arnold, Maité Steinhoudt or Nassim Lachhab in the sense that it’s as exciting to read an interview with them as it is to watch them skate. And I think that’s probably what I find the hardest about doing the mag. You’re constantly struggling to strike this balance between sick, well documented skating and shit people might actually want to read. Like I sometimes get more hyped on doing a piece about somebody like say Elaine Shallcross and her @shuvitcancer campaign (that’ll be in the new issue) than on some next level skater, but if we only had those kinds of articles in the mag it wouldn’t work either.
How important is it to you to see skate photography in print?
To me, it’s not just about seeing skate photography in print, it’s about seeing it in a print magazine. Obviously being able to see them big, touch them, rip them out and stick them on your wall is a huge part of it, but with print magazines comes this idea of really archiving something, like to me those are the photos that will leave a permanent mark on our culture. I always use this stupid example, but do you remember those sick Quicktime videos that regularly used to get posted on the old Crailtap site like 15 years ago? Ever tried finding them? Good luck. Now imagine trying to find a photo that only got posted on Instagram in 15 years.
Is it difficult to keep the print portion of the mag going? Has it been hard to secure the amount of advertisers necessary to cover the costs of the mag?
It’s certainly not easy, but I think what’s helped is that we’ve always been really firm about big brands not being able to access our online audience unless they properly support the print mag. And to be honest, most of the people working for these companies get it, they realize the importance of print magazines in skateboard culture and know that it’s a bad look not to be supporting them.
5-0 to fakie, Photo: Henry Kingsford
Between you, Sam and Will: what is everyone’s role?
To be honest, our roles are quite fluid. Obviously, Sam shoots and edits photos (which neither Will, nor me, can do), so he’ll focus on that more than say web stuff or text. But that doesn’t mean he won’t look over a piece I’ve written for the mag or prepare photos for the site. Like we all deal with advertisers and do invoices, we all help with organizing events, all brainstorm ideas together whether it’s for print or web content. We try to have three pairs of eyes on everything and nothing important gets agreed on unless we’ve voted on it, which makes being three so convenient.
What is it like to work with them?
I think we can all be pretty stubborn and we’re definitely quite different in a lot of ways, so it’s not always easy, especially because we’re so passionate about what we do, but I wouldn’t have it any other way. And I’m really grateful for what they each bring to the mag. Like Sam’s basically my favourite skate photographer and Will is like an encyclopedia for skateboard history. And they’re both such a huge part of that history. Like Sam’s shot so many iconic photos and Will is the kind of dude that has a story for literally every pro skater on earth. ‘Oh the Muska? Yeah I kinda know the Muska.” When we hear a story start off like this we usually already start cracking up. ‘This one time I was stranded at the airport in LA because the person that was suppose to pick me didn’t show up and wasn’t picking up the phone, and for some reason the only other LA phone number I had was the Muska’s. I barely knew him and this is when the Muska was THE MUSKA, so I was a bit scared, but I didn’t have a choice! So he came to pick me up and let me stay with him for a bit. He’s actually really cool.’ Imagine Will just casually dropping that out of nowhere in that funny little squeaky American voice of his haha, like super casual. And just the idea of Will Harmon chilling in the Muskalade! Haha. I fucking love that shit.
What are some of the things you’re the most proud of that you’ve done with the mag?
I’m really proud of what we do to show respect to those that have shaped skateboarding in Europe. Like that Lordz Wheels retrospective thing we did, all those dudes were my heroes growing up, and kind of still are now, and being able to really tell their story and remind everyone of everything they’ve contributed makes me happy. Plus, those dudes are all such legends. It was sick to have an excuse to properly chat to them. And Paco their filmer even dug out all this unseen footage! I’m really stoked we did that.
There’s also a special kind of pride I associate with doing things with people I really love and believe in. For example, the piece we did with Dom Henry. He’s one of my best friends and I was super proud of him for getting all those banging photos and opening up about some of the things he did in that interview. I think he’s one of the best skaters in the world and it feels good to share that with people. Fuck it’s so hard not to sound corny in these things haha.
The more I think about this the more I’m realizing that the reasons I’m proud of certain articles are always quite personal. Like this interview I did with Nelly Mayele about the time he spent in jail for trucking someone. I fucking love that kid, although I guess he’s not really a kid anymore, and I know he really wanted to get that out there to move forward in his life. Or even this interview we did with Lev from Palace. I was skating MWADLANDS almost every day at that point, because it was 2 minutes away from my house and I guess I associate that piece with all the good times spent skating that place. Also, I really admire what he’s done with that company, like the skating they put out, how they treat the people that work for them. And seeing an actual skateboard company that has real pros, that they pay properly, being able to build something like that for South London kids to enjoy for FREE is the sickest shit ever to me. But then on the complete opposite side of the spectrum, there’s things like this piece about Motherhood, Pedagogy and Skateboarding I did with Esther Sayers. I just thought she was really interesting and I really like that it’s not the kind of voice that’s usually heard in skateboard magazines. Plus, I did the interview in Raemers park on a really sunny afternoon, I met her kids, I have really fond memories of working on that thing.
Do you have another job outside of Free?
No, and I know I’m really lucky to be in that position. I’m definitely not making the kind of money that would allow me to save and buy a house or anything like that, but I make enough to pay rent and drink pints with my friends on the weekend, which is fine for this stage of my life.
The Free Instagram is constantly updated with good shit. Who runs it? How do you guys think about Instagram and its role for the mag?
Cheers man. I’m super self-conscious about running out of shit to say on there, so this is the perfect opportunity for me to share the responsibility for the captions sometimes being kind of dead haha. So my answer is ‘we all do it!’, but realistically I probably post a bit more than they do.
To be honest, it’s just one of the many tools that’s available for us to get stuff out there. Although, it’s the one we really chose to focus on loads when we first started because it instantly got a lot of traction (in part thanks to what I mentioned earlier). Also, at first our approach was to have the main video releases on the site exclusive (as in only viewable on our site) so that nobody would be able to cut out extracts from them for their Instagrams saying ‘watch this video at bla bla bla other website’. Our reasoning here was that if our Instagram/site were the only places you could watch this stuff they would inevitably grow quicker. And then once our Instagram had a decent following we stopped making videos only viewable on our site and shifted the focus towards growing the YouTube. It’s obviously hard to say what exactly did it, but I reckon that strategy helped a lot. And also I guess we’ve done our best to adapt quickly whenever Instagram has changed. Like say they introduce the swipe function: we make it our gimmick to loop our favourite trick from a line when you swipe, that sort of thing. It’s so neeky all this haha, but it definitely played a big part in us getting to where we are.
Are brands or filmmakers coming to you to partner on video releases often?
Yeah, lots of brands/filmmakers have been coming to us, especially recently as it’s grown a lot in the last year or so. We’re also constantly talking to skaters and filmers, so we sort of know what a lot of people are working on and if something good is on the way we’ll get on their case haha.
Do you ever have to turn down videos?
Yeah definitely, I feel like turning down videos takes up a lot of my time these days. And it’s not fun. Especially when somebody has worked on something for ages, but being selective and making sure you only put out stuff you think is interesting is so important. It’s one of the things that defines your ‘brand’ as a magazine.
What do you look for in the videos you do post?
For us to want to release something it doesn’t even have to be the gnarliest skating ever or even filmed/put together amazingly. It just has to have something about it that gets us hyped. And people sometimes struggle to remember that skateboarding is very subjective and there’s loads of other magazines out there that might be into something we’ve turned down. We regularly see stuff we’ve turn down on Thrasher or Transworld, like it doesn’t have to end with us passing on it. Also, if we pass on someone’s video once, it doesn’t mean we won’t like the next one and we always encourage people to keep submitting stuff. Fuck, I’m scared people are going to be afraid to submit shit now haha. If you’re reading this and working on something you’d like to submit, PLEASE SEND IT OVER: [email protected]
Ride on 50-50, Switch Ride on 50-50, Photo: Raf Wojnowski
Have you guys considered making more Free clothing?
We’ve done a few runs of shirts already and they sold pretty well, but yeah it’s definitely something we’re going to try to push more in the future. We’ve been finding it hard to make time. For the last run, we got Brian Lotti to do a shirt though.
Where are you from and how did you start skating?
I’m French; born close to Paris, but grew up skating in Lyon. I spent a lot of time at that famous Hotel De Ville plaza with the benches/pyramid and the mini ramp across the bridge from it. I still think it’s one of the best cities in the world to skate; it’s got so many legendary spots from the Cliché videos, Sorry, Menikmati (because Cliché/French Fred were there) and that plaza is honesty like better than MACBA, especially since it’s been redone. Plus, there’s tons of banging kebab, tandoori wrap and traditional French bakeries all around it. It’s practically on the river so you can just walk down and drink beers by the water after skating. And those benches. The stone they are made out of has just the right amount of resistance for it to feel and sound incredible, but you can grind forever! It’s almost like pool coping or something.
You went to University right? What did you take and what were you planning on doing after school?
Yeah, I studied to become a simultaneous interpreter, like those dudes that are sat in the booths at EU conferences. It was super fun, you’d get a proper adrenaline rush when you were in the booth and it was your turn to interpret! You’d have to prepare for conferences on all sorts of topics too, so it was also a good way to learn about random shit.
How did you end up working for Kingpin?
I did an internship there right after I finished high school and years later when they were looking for someone Sam put me forward. The job offer came a few months after I’d started to look for work as an interpreter and I think when I got it I’d just come back from two weeks in this mad conference centre in the Caux, Switzerland. I’d basically just been in the mountains eating fondu and doing simultaneous translation for a pretty serious NGO forum and I sort of thought that life was going to look a lot like that moving forward. I remember pranging out about not being be able to skate as much haha. Haven’t thought about all that stuff in a while, it feels kind of weird. Life would probably be pretty different if I’d turned down that Kingpin job.
Your shared part with JB a few years back was really sick. So you’re still finding time to skate these days?
Cheers man! Highlight of my life right there! Yeah I still skate at least 3/4 times a week. Mainly Stockwell Skatepark in the winter cause I can’t really be bothered to ollie too much when it’s cold and the ground is shit. But when the weather gets better I always try to go on little missions with Dom Henry and my friend Quentin Guthrie that films. He makes really sick edits.
If someone reading this wants to work in skateboarding, particularly on the media side, what advice would you give them?
Ooof I’m not too sure to be honest, I can’t help but feel like I kinda ended up here, owning/running a mag with Sam and Will, it’s kind of by luck. Like I’m not deluded: I know I’m not some incredible writer, I’m not an SEO wizard either, I don’t film or shoot photos. I guess I just really love skateboarding and know what I like. Fuck, that’s not very useful advice.
But it is. Being passionate about something and working hard to pursue it, and having a point of view are all super important.
True. I guess what I’ll say is if you want to work in media, make sure what you’re doing reflects you and what you’re into. And stick to your guns. That’s kind of why Free is called Free: we wanted it to be free from the constraints that were imposed by our previous publisher, but also free from the ‘conventions’ adopted by skateboard magazines in the past: like every issue has to have a Check Out, every issue has 3 tour articles and 4 interviews. Like if we want to use up three pages of the mag for some random piece about a guy in Canada that’s been looking at skateboarding through the lens of neuroscience to help traumatized kids, we can. We’re also free to speak about whatever we want: if we want to publish a piece about the skate industry turning a blind eye on all that Jason Jesse shit, we can. Or call out Street League for coming to London and marketing knives to kids when the city is going through a knife crime crisis. If we want to interview Jarne about battling his addictions and he wants to talk about crying on the way to his coke dealer, we’re going to print that.
Switch backside nose grind, Photo: Henry Kingsford
Can you ask him about setting up a subscription service in the US?